I’m proud of my wife. I’m proud of my kids (most of the time!). I’m sometimes proud of this site, and of the people who have made it a good place to grow in faith and knowledge. I’m also proud of my country, and its forefathers who designed it to preserve freedom as well as it has (so far).
But then there’s this handy little verse I memorized as a kid: Proverbs 16:18 – Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall. Do the above statements make me prideful in the sense that this verse is talking about?
Of course not.
One of the biggest problems with Stanton’s exegeses of scripture is that they refuse to think critically about the meaning of the words being used. Pride in the King James era meant vanity and haughtiness. You can see that clearly, even in the oft-quoted verse above. Pride goes before destruction, and a HAUGHTY spirit before a fall.
Now, if I walk around in haughtiness that my wife is better than yours, or that my kids are smarter than yours, or anything like that, maybe the “haughty” descriptor would fit. But 99% of the time, when we use the phrase “I’m proud of X,” we don’t mean that.
When you study the scripture—and I mean really study deeply—it’s good to bookmark a Greek or Hebrew dictionary (lexicon). That way you can see the original word that was translated into English (which won’t be very meaningful), but also the different meanings of that word, and locations they are used elsewhere in scripture. The three most popular lexicons are Strong’s, Thayer’s, and Vine’s.
- Strong’s. Strong’s is the most exhaustive concordance, but also has Greek (NT) and Hebrew (OT) word cross references.
- Thayer’s. Thayer’s is limited to Greek words, and is a bit more thorough than Vines.
- Vine’s. Vine’s covers Greek words only. I really like Vine’s over Thayer’s, because it’s written and formatted in a really understandable way. It’s super easy to find other verses that use the exact same Greek word, so you don’t have just rely on the Greek scholar’s definition. You can look at the context of other scriptures that use the same word, and perhaps figure out the correct definition based on that.
These things have real-life consequences. I know people from Stanton who have avoided telling their kids “I’m proud of you” because of this verse. Yet one of the most important things you can give your kids is your approval and praise while growing up. If all they hear is the criticism, with no affirmation of how proud you are of them (find something, even if you have to think about it awhile!), you will not have the relationship with them that you want. All because of an easily avoidable BAD exegesis of scripture.
Spot on Kevin. Recently discussing pride with an ex. member of the cult and a dear friend who I attend church with now. I never bought into the teaching of the cult concerning pride. Though I too would not use the word simply to tow the line. It is so ridiculous to hear some of the members “substitute” words they’d use rather than using the word proud in the proper context as you mentioned.
I agree, though, there are plenty of other ways to express approval of someone rather than saying you are proud of them. However, when you stated, ‘Now, if I walk around in haughtiness that my wife is better than yours, or that my kids are smarter than yours, or anything like that, maybe the “haughty” descriptor would fit.’, that seems to exactly describe Stanton’s views of it’s church. While Christ did die for one church, he never told that church to boast of it, as it was a gift from God, and not because of anything they did. Interesting that… Read more »
I heard about the shooting and forwarded the article to other members of our security team in our church. No one wants to use force to defend innocent life, but sometimes it is forced upon us.
Curious Chris, Christ died for his church. Hopefully you understand by now that one church is not Merie’s cult.
Can you advise exactly how calling Stanton a cult is leading to change?
Does Christ want to destroy sinners, or bring them to salvation?
Is that not the same with churches?
Anyone can name call.
Few can identify the ideas that lead to individual and church change.
Which are you?
Do you approve of Stanton telling people they lost their mind?
If not, then how is repetitively calling them a cult any different, while refusing to acknowledge the good they do?
Curious Chris, I call Merie’s church a cult because it is one. I’m only seeking to expose them for what and who they are. Change will only come if they close up shop and join a healthy church. Easy to identify it as a cult. You have brought up some key identifiers. You choose not to call it a cult so be it. Christ wants to bring sinners to salvation. Yes, Christian churches want to bring sinners to salvation. Name calling? It’s simply identifying them as what they are. A cult. When I reference them to my wife I call… Read more »
I’m sure they have some pretty flattering names for you too, Craig. And, nothing will be resolved. Which church do you propose they join? Catholics, Mormons, SDA, JW’s, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Episcopals, Pentecostals? Rather than calling them a cult, why not define what the Bible says they should be? Wow, I’m surprised you say that to your wife, I’m sure calling the church she attends a cult does wonders for friendly relationships. I have no problem telling the truth, but, it can be said two ways. To tear down maliciously, or to break down that which needs breaking down, and to… Read more »
Curious Chris, yes they may have some flattering names for me. Once again Curious Chris, you too have identified them as a cult. Go back and read your comments. I do not believe any church is perfect. Churches I’ve attended and especially the one I attend now do teach the doctrine of Christ. They guess what? Also teach on sin. Can you believe that Curious Chris. You’ve probably heard within the cult you adore that everywhere else do not teach on sin. Another lie that they teach. Merie’s cult is far from perfect. I’d go nowhere before attending such a… Read more »
No, my differences is with ideology, not people and the church. Writing off an entire organization is a great way to make sure you shut their ears to everything one has to say. Jesus didn’t approach the Jews that way, and neither should we approach Stanton that way. Jesus clearly highlighted their doctrinal errors and what would happen if they didn’t repent, but he hoped for the redemption of the Jews, as we should for Stanton, and indeed, for all men. Blessed are the merciful, for they shall find mercy. If Abraham earnestly prayed to preserve Sodom and Gomorrha, which… Read more »
Outside of learning from this current COC since the early 80’s, I have read a lot of the COC, that Merie came out of, taught and saw a lot of what made them go off. I have studied to an extent what other religions teach. My mindset is that they do have the premise of what the true church has, but are not following it and/or applying it properly. They hold the truth of God in unrighteousness. Where the bible speaks they don’t practice. I look at them more like the seven churches in Asia in Revelation. there are some… Read more »
In studying narcissistic leaders I find they will have two kinds of followers: a golden child who can do no wrong and scapegoats who can do no right. There is such thing as a “thinking error” when an individual has a bias and does not realize it. One thinking error is discounting the positive where an individual will dismiss, discredit, or diminish all the good you do and only see the negative, this is how scapegoats are treated. The opposite thinking error is discounting the negative where an individual will dismiss, discredit, or diminish all the negative a follower does… Read more »
Yes, indeed, there is preferring in Stanton, and it’s especially apparent in churches with dominant women teachers, who have cliques. Their inner circle gets preferential treatment. They are clearly not out for the benefit of the entire church. The women teachers frequently have sympathetic feelings for those who treat them nice, and can go on the warpath at the drop of a dime against any who disagree with them, their families, or their ideas. Wonder who the carpenter from Montclair is, and what movie did he watch that got him withdrawn from? Was it the ‘Ten Commandments’? We do see,… Read more »
The movie was the passion of the Christ. The carpenter now lives in San Antonio TX, and the point intended was that when a “golden child” is made to suffer they will not accept a lower seat but will choose to fall away rather than endure the humiliation of being disfellowshipped.
Interesting. I also heard, from an evangelist, that the preacher from San Antonio, who was a very hard working, and righteous family man, (though I don’t understand watching movies and television at all, as both are inferior communication methods, and the Christian leaders for 1,900 years, up until 1900, understood the Bible a whole lot better than we do without television and movies.) was criticized for attacking welfare. The San Antonio preacher had worked hard as a contractor all his life, and had, as a result, obtained a very successful construction company. Well, the Scriptures do say that the heart… Read more »
So, these nefarious machinations are what is behind the situation where it’s hard for a man to provide for his wife and family. Also, women were given the vote in 1920 with the 19th Amendment, and when women joined the work force en masse in 1941, when Japan bombed Pearl Harbor, it effectively doubled the labor force, and halved the wages. Women voting has been a disaster for them and America, just like women teaching men in church has been a disaster for them, their families, and Stanton. God never gave women the ability to make dispassionate decisions that are… Read more »
Interesting post Mr. Kevin. I hesitate to agree completely with you due to the issue of backsliding. In the new testament I read of Christians who were raised under the Jewish faith who would backslide into Judaism demanding circumcisions and today I see similar examples of people who were raised in big business, I mean false religion, like seven day Adventist who demand christians eat health food or do as the Lutherans teach or do as the Jehovah’s witnesses teach even though they have left those religions for the COC many years ago they backslide into their former religions teaching… Read more »
The most obvious connection Merie’s Church has to pride is their one teaching that feeds all of their pride: That only Merie’s church is going to Heaven. That THEY and only they hold the truth. For a people who use the word PRIDE so little in their daily conversation with their children, they are exactly the HAUGHTY Spirit the Bible teaches us not to be. Their nonmember classes, as well as other classes and fellowships are riddled with this same haughty spirit. And it’s contagious, as we know. It’s prideful to be in constant judgment of others. I don’t mean… Read more »
Had Merie obeyed the Bible, and not usurped the authority of the man to teach, there would be no Stanton. Of course, women are still trying to teach, and refusing to take on the roles God assigned them, to raise children, and to teach other women and children. Stanton is a very feelings-based church. If the teachers FEEL you don’t like them because you disagree with them, you’re consigned to church punishment, and it could last for decades. This irrational and unreasonable approach is exactly why they simply cannot grow, no matter how hard they try. They blame how bad… Read more »
Below are excerpts from an article entitled Marxist Feminism’s Ruined Lives. It was written by Mallory Millett whose sister, Kate Millett author of “The Bible of Women’s Liberation,” was heavily involved in the beginnings of NOW and the move to infiltrate feminism into every area of society. It’s goal? Destroy the family. Read it and weep for our culture. Carefully ponder sending your daughters to college which are filled with toxic feminist teachings against God’s ways for them. Train them up in grace, femininity, and beauty. Let’s reclaim biblical womanhood for our daughters and steer them in the direction of… Read more »
I saw a different application of Proverbs 16:18. I saw my teaching preacher and his wife, also a teacher flatter new babes with love bombing , plenty of attention, never reproving them as long as the babes were doing exactly as the teachers wanted. I watched babe after babe come into the church get puffed up with pride due to the inordinate affection given to them then when the babe did something the teacher did not like, being the center of attention one to many times, for an example, then the leadership would cause them to fail by withdrawing their… Read more »
One of the main problems with Stanton, is women, beginning with Merie, usurping the man’s role and teaching. Women will claim the men aren’t fit to lead, but they have been fighting for power since day one. Keep in mind, no woman in the New Testament or in early America was teaching men. Yet, today, in Stanton, there is no shortage of women who insist on teaching men. Again from Lori Alexander at ‘The Transformed Wife’. Last Saturday, I published this handwritten post on Facebook and of course, women just loved it! Not. If you look at the comment section,… Read more »
Today, JI, from Huntsville, AL, preached a powerful sermon. He detailed how the church has misconstrued fear, and so, because they misunderstand and misinterpret Gods love, they are unable to show this love to their own families, brethren, and the world. Quite true. Was very truly emotional, as he wears his heart on his sleeve. However, it was touching and healing. It’s what you would expect when women run a church. He didn’t say it, but he remarked that he loved the church he was raised in with some powerful women teachers, but he didn’t want to get baptized there.… Read more »
In looking for examples of haughty people who took a fall I think of Nebachadezz who when he had exalted himself apparently lost his sanity and was driven from men until seven times had passed over. I also think of Herod who when praised that his voice was the voice of a god and not of a man was smitten with worms and fell down dead. The greatest weakness of the arrogant is flattery even self flattery. Flattery gives the arrogant what the desire the most and that is the “feeling” of supremacy. I think how different Christ was when… Read more »
Anon, excellent points. The lack of love is consistent in Merie’s cult. It all stems from Merie on down to leadership of today. They claim to be the only ones who know what true love is. That is a complete joke.
Lori – I am amazed at the wisdom of God in your post and your courage to share it. This is not a popular message but a critically needed one. There is an absolute crisis with troubled marriages in the Church because MOST Christian leaders are either ignorant or too afraid to embrace the truths you shared from scripture regarding the GOD ORDAINED roles for husbands and wives. Instead, the Church has adopted the world’s views in subtle ways where there is no distinction in gender roles AS GOD has designed and ordained them. The root of that crisis is… Read more »
A recurring theme in Stanton is teaching on pity parties, depression, and discouragement. Every human in history has dealt with these, they are not uncommon. What defines humans is not if they deal with these, it is how they respond to them. Do we allow them to overwhelm us and make us leave our obedience to God, or do we continue in righteousness no matter what happens, as Habakkuk says in Chapter 3? 17 Although the fig tree shall not blossom, neither shall fruit be in the vines; the labour of the olive shall fail, and the fields shall yield… Read more »
All the women teachers in Stanton have been tearing down men for as long as they have been teaching, going back to Merie Weis. Remember, she was withdrawn from for usurping the man’s authority, and women ever since have been busily engaged in doing the exact same thing. Funny, she was a teacher, and yet, she didn’t have to work, as the husband she refused to submit to (Can anyone imagine Merie Weis submitting to a husband in marriage, I sure can’t?), provided for her for all her life. She received a 6 unit condo unit, and lived off of… Read more »
Curious Chris, you’re doing a fine job describing them as a cult without using the word. Maybe i’m the only one who continues to say it “cult”, however, I’m not the only one who believes and knows that they are a cult. You have done quite well with letting it be known “your only belief”on many topics. Name calling as well. Continue on my friend. You’re doing a great work exposing Merie’s cult.